An interview with mystic midlife rebel Jocelyne Leach about your vibrant second half of life.
Jocelyne Leach calls herself a mystical midlife rebel. She's a personal and spiritual empowerment coach, mentor, and intuitive for women who want a joyful, vibrant second half of life.
We’re talking about second acts and the opportunities present for us at middle age to finally do something meaningful with our lives.
GUEST LINKS - JOCELYNE LEACH
HOST LINKS - SLADE ROBERSON
BECOME A PATRON
Okay, well it was about 10 years ago. Probably everyone can remember 10 years ago when the shit hit the fan in the financial markets and it just felt like the whole world collapsing. The news was just terrible. Every day was very depressing.
At the time, my husband and I were... We had two businesses that were quite vulnerable to fluctuating markets, and one was a pub and restaurant. One was a property development business.
And so, when the markets take a dive, people stop eating out and property takes a dive. The whole thing just imploded.
So my husband was extremely stressed. He got taken to hospital seriously ill with three perforated ulcers. At the time, I was uncharacteristically stressed and unhappy and suffering as well. Usually I'm quite a grounded person. So for me to feel all these kind of... the emotional wrangling of all this going on. It made me think, I've gotta get to the doctor and get some medication to help me through this.
And I thought, No, that's not the route I want to go. I need to sort this out myself.
So I started two things. One thing you might not know about me is I'm also a yoga teacher. So I really dug back into my yoga practice that had got a little bit kind of wishy washy. I dug back into that and took up a more powerful type of yoga.
That helped a great deal. It really gave me something to focus on that took the thoughts out of my head because it was the thoughts that were just driving me crazy.
And then, at that time, about 10 years ago, the internet was really starting to take off. And so, the wonderful thing of search engines were I could just keep finding different people on the internet who would give me words of wisdom that started me moving forward and kind of climbing out of my big black hole.
It's things like finding Byron Katie and reading her books and beginning to kind of control my mindshit, basically. And that was how I started to kind of turn my ship around, basically.
And I think at the same time, I was also having a bit of a mid-life crisis. I was kind of late-40s and just wondering what my life had all been about, because I had always been involved with the family business in one form or another. And I've never really pushed out on my own and done anything that I felt was my particular career, so to speak.
So it just started that journey. And yoga, really, was the catalyst that got me into more and more kind of spiritual and metaphysical stuff.
When I first started yoga, it was just a physical practice. I wasn't into any mumbo jumbo at all. It was kind of a physical practice so I wasn't interested in anything like chanting or meditation or anything like that. But when the need arose, I needed to get into that place of being calmer and finding tools for my mind.
So that's really how it all evolved.
That's interesting. I did not know that you were a yoga teacher.
I have a pretty special place in my heart as well for yoga. I sort of feel like it was the thing that allowed me to... It's funny, I... Like what you just said. It started as a physical practice for you and then the mumbo jumbo came later.
I started out with the mumbo jumbo, and when I went looking for something to physically heal me, I had had a surgery which cut into my core muscles and I was a smoker for 20 years. So at that time, I was recovering from surgery and smoking, and I thought, Ugh, this is disgusting, to be doing these two things at the same time.
So I started to think, What is the representation of the breath in healing form? What is a replacement behaviour for smoking? And I really quickly landed on yoga, as being the kind of intersection of all that stuff. And I thought, Yay! I went to yoga as this mystic already!
And it was funny because I really quickly was drawn into more of power yoga and as I built up that core strength and became more and more physically strong, and of course I did quit smoking and did yoga instead of smoking, I became extremely physically empowered and alive in my own body in a way that I'd never experienced.
We're talking, like, I was 41 when that happened, so... It ultimately led me to all the fitness that I do now, because I was like, Ah, I do the mumbo jumbo stuff in my day job. I want to lift weights and be a crossfit cult member, so I went that route.
One of the things that I have noticed is, a lot of people who are yoga instructors may go into it as a physical practice, as a job, and somewhere along the way, they start to discover that they can read energy, that they are intuitive, then they start to pick up a lot of stuff especially if they're touching clients sometimes.
Did any of that happen to you?
Yeah. Exactly how it happened.
Like I said, I was more into the physical side of it, but I began to notice that, and I think I've always had this attribute, of being able to read people's energy. And I think it goes right back to childhood. I don't know why, but that was just always how I felt that I could understand people. I could look at them and I could kind of guess what was going on.
And I began to notice that when people are in my class, I could figure out what was going on for them. And I began to notice that people were quite interested, in fact, they really demanded that I would make the classes in a way that they could tap into their own energy.
It was the beginning of class where I used to, when it was quite a physical practice for me, I didn't really have a run in into class. We'd do maybe a couple of breaths just to show willing. And then I'd go straight into the physical practice.
And then I began to see that people more and more wanted me to take them into more of a breathing sequence and to decompress them from their day. So the start of my class where we just do a couple minutes of breathing began to be 10 or 15 minutes of breathing. At first I thought, Oh, I don't know if I should be doing this. I don't think people will like it.
But more and more, I found that was part of the reason they were coming. And so it went from there. And then I began to really see the difference that it was making to people and I began to put my foot into the other aspects. The more ethereal aspects of yoga.
And it was quite a journey. Learning the history of yoga and realizing there are things that, what you might call the new age community had adopted, like working with chakras and visualizations and stuff like that. They were all things that had been part of yoga practice for thousands of years.
And that's what led me into studying other things like astrology and hand reading and the akashic records. Because all of those also belong to vedic studies. So it's quite fascinating how that all unfolded for me.
Do you still, I'm just curious if you still work with astrology at all.
Yeah, I do.
Some of the most powerful readings I've ever had in astrology have been vedic astrology readings. I haven't been studying vedic astrology. But I have been studying western astrology and when I work with people now, I just always take their birth dates so I at least know what sign they are. Because that gives me a lot of information.
Because a lot of my work is about energy, whether it's physical, mental, emotional, what have you. And things like astrology help you cut through a lot of chit chat. It gets you to the heart of the matter more quickly.
Yeah. The reason I ask about that is because astrology is emerging as a theme in all my interviews right now. There are at least three people on this season who are specifically astrologers. But then when you mentioned that, I felt like I needed to ask, because this is a theme and I have been sort of reinvigorated around using that in my practice.
I actually used to use, like, someone's natal chart was almost like a meditation or a gateway image for me to do readings, so I come from having done astrological charts for extra money when I was a teenager, when I was in college, for my parents' friends and some people in my family. Stuff like that.
And so, I've always asked for that information for a client because if I know their sun, moon and rising sign, I can talk for an hour about what that tells me about them, you know?
At that point, all the intuitive stuff comes in as well.
I used to think, maybe I'm just kind of using this as a crutch. Maybe I'm just sort of using that as my way to log in, as we say. But then with all of you that I'm having these conversations with, I had sort of just backed away from including that on my intake forms. Now I'm rethinking, Oh wait a minute, I feel like my Guides and the Universe is all telling me, No, no. There's more to do with that. Keep that in place. It's a very useful vocabulary.
I think so.
It goes along with another thing I do, which is to do with yoga. Which is ayurvedic medicine, which is kind of the Indian version of traditional chinese medicine.
I do a, not with every client, but with some of my clients, I'll give them a kind of questionnaire thing that they complete, which also gives me their dosha, which is a physical representation of energy, so it goes into elemental energy like in astrology.
For example, if I use me as an example, I'm a Gemini so I've got a lot of mental air energy. But physically, I've got a lot of earth energy. So it gives me a great understanding of someone if I know what their physical energy type is along with their mental energy type.
So if I'm helping someone in more of a wellness way, which was my previous iteration in coaching. I was a lot more focused on wellness and health because that kind of went with the yoga.
And then I started building the more mystical and intuitive skills now, so I'm veering more in that direction. It gave me a really good picture of that person quite quickly and I'm all for something that kind of cuts through stuff and you can get to the heart of the matter much more quickly.
The same goes with the hand analysis. I learned how to do hand analysis and the energy shows up in the lines and the fingerprints in the hands as well.
So all those things kind of tie in.
Wow, so if you have a client there in person with you, do you usually read their hand as well?
I do do in person hand reading things. They're usually mini sessions. I'm lucky enough to teach my yoga classes, the majority of them, at a local spa that opened a few years ago. I offer a kind of 45-minute mini session. So I do that in person.
But if I'm seeing someone long distance, then I like to send them a kit so they can print their hand prints for me. They send them back and I look at the printed version of their handprints.
And in honesty, I prefer doing that.
Because number one, it gives me a bit more time to just kind of mull over what I'm seeing. And secondly, with ink print, you get more fine detail. And quite often, I'm a bit distracted if I've got a person physically in that space, all expectant-like.
I get stage fright a bit. I quite like to be kind of tucked up in my office, and just kind of mulling and ruminating over the information I've got so that I can present it in a more cogent way.
I didn't know that you could do that! That you could do prints with ink and send them to someone and that they can... I've never thought of that before!
Yes, it is. It's much, much more fun.
Well, it also allows you the time to create a more meaningful volume of information. Because I think there's a tendency, you know, like, it's weird to just let a stranger hold your hand for most people for a long amount of time. I can see where there would be some kind of, a little bit of almost like a social space pressure to not sit there and manhandle them for 15 or 20 minutes.
So to be able to have that kind of intellectual distance and to study the information kind of outside of that whole issue of touching or being in someone's personal space.
I find it easier to read for people that I cannot see, that I'm not physically in the same room with. I often describe it as being like, when you are listening to music and you want to concentrate, you close your eyes. It's like getting rid of a lot of the senses that you don't need in that moment, so that you can sort of put all your focus on that intuitive channel, essentially.
Yeah, I think that's exactly it. I don't appreciate the distraction because I'm easily distracted anyway, so if I see an expression or something that... It can put me into my headspace, and I don't really want to be there. I want to be more into my intuitive space.
The other thing I find especially with hand analysis, if I'm there with the person, and it's kind of, Cross my palm with silver, dearie, that kind of vibe, where if I'm at more a distance, it seems more, whatever the word is...
Yeah. The opposite of being at the end of the pier, or in a fairground.
Right. It's more elevated.
Yeah. Exactly. Exactly.
You know, I come from a family where this is the kind of stuff that is not believed in. All my family think I'm a proper weirdo. And they're the kind of people where if you can see it, then you believe it. And I'm more, you see, actually, what you believe, and more in that intuitive space.
They all look at me kind of a bit cock-eyed, as if a bit, Uh oh, What's she up to now?
Well, every family needs one.
Well that's what I think. I'm letting my weird flag fly now and I don't mind.
So talk to me a little bit about how your practices evolved. I imagine some of your yoga students become people who want personal sessions from you. Or that you kind of evolve the practice into doing more of the intuitive work and the coaching.
Looking at your website, there's a focus around living a vibrant second half of life.
You talked about the fact that your story, at one point sort of going through a midlife crisis. So talk to me about what this second half of life is about.
I think for women particularly, it's a kind of a point in life where women at a certain age, I don't want them to throw in the towel. I don't want them to think, Well I've got to a certain age, and I've got to start smalling things down now and contracting, kind of metaphorically speaking.
What tends to happen is life kinda gets you when you're at mid-life. The thing that started me on my journey might not be typical for everyone, but it does and it can involve a certain amount of loss. It can be loss of your partner through divorce or through death, or loss of your health or jobs, or your kids moving out of your home, all sorts of things like that.
I see it with my friends and my clients. There are great pressures on women at this age. There's barely a woman I've come across that doesn't have something of this kind of challenge going on for them. For most women, it's kind of unexpected, or it's more challenging than they thought it would be at this time of life.
It's an accumulation of everything that's kind of topped off by the cherry on the top, which is having the menopause. So it challenges them from every part of their being - physical, mental, emotional, spiritual. You name it. It feels like you're powerless and you're a bit stuck. And it's all downhill from here on.
I don't think that should be necessary. Not in this day and age and also, 50 isn't how 50 was when my grandmother was 50. And I think if people, well women especially, if they feel empowered again, that's how their second half becomes magical and meaningful. And they can live joyfully and have a vibrant second half of life.
So that's what my job I feel is. To guide them and coach them at this time. To see the other side of this kind of void. And have a clear and inspired plan for a much more empowered, brighter future.
What kinds of things do you see these women going on to do, like what kind of breakthroughs do they arrive at? Do they start businesses? Create new projects? What kind of result, really, happens when they become more empowered?
Yeah, I have had clients and friends who have the catalyst for them having to do something in their life, is maybe the loss of their marriage. So they've had to really think, Well, you know, I've been a homemaker for 25 years. I've got to do something now. And they'll start a business.
I have several friends that have started businesses at a time in life where you think, Wow, that's a bit plucky.
But they haven't had the choice because they've been thrown into that situation.
Or, you know, if a partner had become seriously ill, or they've become debilitated in some way, women have to step up maybe and start being more of a breadwinner.
So that's definitely something that I've noticed in women of this age and sometimes it's just they're ready for a kind of an awakening themselves. They're ready to find more about the spiritual side of life, or about aspects of life they haven't had time to pursue before if they were busy doing other things. You know, the kids leave home, you might have downsized, you might have downsized work-wise.
Something else is calling and it's kind of like a clarion call to remember that you probably got more years behind you than you have ahead of you, so what are you going to do with those valuable years that you've got left?
And they're open in a new way, right?
The good news is... Because I attract this type of client as well. Women who are finally at a point where their energy is not being required by everyone else at quite the same amount. So what they're finding is they're sort of welling up with all this self-awareness and this creativity, and these sort of blank slates, and this sort of open space.
Now, some people probably panic and dig in and freak out about all that, and wanting it to stay the same, so to speak. But the clients that I attract in my practice are like, Okay, well wait a minute, I've got all this time and all this energy and I'm not done yet, so what am I going to do now?
It's really exciting to me because I feel like it's almost a second act, on the kind of energy that you see with college students, you know?
I was a student adviser at a university before I started doing this work, and I see a real connection between the mindset of someone who is 19 years old and trying to choose a major for their study and then women who are in midlife who are coming to me wanting to discuss reconnecting to their creativity, starting a passion project of their own, doing something that they've always wanted to do.
Do you see that kind of energy that I'm talking about?
Absolutely. I think it's that kind of Saturn return effect and the need, I see, for people not to stop being creative, you know? Keep being creative.
No matter how modest your dreams are, you need a new dream. You need to redesign your garden or redecorate the house or whatever it is. But you've got to keep having something to get up for in the morning. Otherwise you just kind of wither and die.
So for some people, it would be modest dreams. For some people, it's like, yeah! I'm gonna open an animal sanctuary. I've got the time, I've got the space. I can do that now.
They might want to travel. They might want to really do charity work or something that is meaningful for them, that they haven't had a chance to do before. Or just reinvent themselves in some other way that is meaningful to them. So that they really do get a chance to do what they might not have done when they were younger.
Women in midlife too, have decades of practice doing multiple things at once. They're multi-taskers just by requirement. Almost everyone who's a mom.
I joke with the moderators of my Shift Your Spirits community, which you are one of our moderators, I jokingly said to you guys, I pick ladybosses and moms. Because you guys are used to kind of doing a whole lot of everything, and dealing with everyone's stuff, you know, to put it nicely. And you have a lot of practice at getting on with shit. You know what I mean?
Yes I do.
I really like this type of client because they're not coming in with a lot of hand wringing. They come in with a lot of energy and are looking for some place to spend it. They want to be encouraged and enabled to pour themselves into something and to be encouraged.
Bring it on!
I love to brainstorm. And I love it when people bring me their animal sanctuary passion projects and they need some support and encouragement to make that happen.
What do you hope personally to contribute to this greater world of coaching and empowerment. What's your message you'd like to leave out there?
I think my main message is, what happened for me 10 years ago is that I really found out about myself. I dug down deep enough so that I could understand myself better. And I think that's the key, is to really know and understand yourself fully. Because then you can tackle the things that are your life lessons, that are your repeating patterns, the things that have kind of kept tripping you up.
That thing about, you always go out with the same guy, or you always keep doing the same things and you have the same triggers.
If people could just experience what it is to know themselves better, then it's a very empowering feeling to suddenly think, Okay, actually If I scroll back a bit, when I first had my hand analysis reading done for myself before I trained to do it, I had several coaching sessions where the lady did the technique that I described to you earlier, and everything she said to me wasn't a huge surprise.
It was all stuff that I kind of knew about myself already. But it gave me kind of confirmation about who I really was.
So then when I knew who I really was, it was like, Well, there's no good in me worrying about the fact that I'm no good at maths. Why don't I just keep pursuing the things that are my gifts and turn my gifts into spectacular gifts. You know, something I can really do something with. Rather than just be sad there wondering, lacking confidence and being triggered by all the things that triggered me in the past.
I think a lot of us are the kind of stuck when we were triggered as a 10 year old or 14 year old. And I think, as a society, if a 10 year old or 14 year old died, it's a tragedy. The whole wider community feels that loss.
But how many people go to their grave still being triggered as they were when they were a 10 year old or a 14 year old? I think that's a tragedy. I think how awful, that you're really dying as a 10 year old.
Mmm... I had a client just recently that I did a reading with who expressed that she had wanted to be a writer when she was much younger, and that when she was 14 years old, her mother just really shut her down around that whole connection to herself. And, you know, it died, like you said, a spiritual death.
So here she was, at this stage in life that we're talking about, looking to reconnect to that. I hope she hears this episode and what you just said. Because I really feel that it spoke to the reading that we did. I think she's a fan of the show, so she's probably nodding along right now. And it affirms the message that I brought through for her as well.
I want to mention and not forget, because I love this title so much, if everyone goes to your website, they can get a free download. The title is "7 ways to instantly get calm in the middle of a shitstorm!"
Tell us about that.
Yeah, I'm a little irreverent. I think if you join up to my list, you might need to know that.
That's a 7 day email series. Each day someone is sent a tip about a different way to kind of get a grip on whatever is triggering you, basically. One particular day, there might be a visualization and a breathing technique to calm. There might be some physical things to do, like jumping jacks or something like that, to get out of your head and into your body.
It might be a recipe with essential oils, something like that. It could be dietary tips or something a bit more practical. So it's just 7 days of different things that could help you feel as if you've got a grip.
It sounds like a lot of people would be interested in checking that out.
Jocelyne, thank you for taking the time to speak with me today. Tell us where we can go to find you online.
My website, it's a little long-winded, but it's http://www.jocelynekelseyleach.com/ I think you'll put that in the notes or...
Awesome. Wonderful. That was great, Jocelyne. Thank you for coming on the show!
That's my pleasure. Cheery bye for now!
About the Show
Fewer hearts and flowers than most New Age blather.